Raids

[Vayne]

I'm not sure that this will work for GW2's business plan. Or that they even care that much about retention. I mean sure, if you're not playing anymore your unlikely to buy on their cash-shop. Don't forget that their business plan doesn't focus around keeping you paying every month.

The question is, will raiders pay more than casuals? Because I guess the process of designing good raid content on a regular basis (like for instance in WoW every few months a new one plus regular 5 man dungeons to add with various difficulty levels) is much more expensive for them than doing other events like seasonal stuff (see halloween; I guess for christmas there'll be something too, or even for thanksgiving before that). But they would be expected to do the seasonal stuff anyway as that's pretty much standard nowadays, so the raids would probably cost extra developers. And I also think you are probably overestimating the manpower they have. This is not as big a company as Blizzard. For them these undertakings are quite risky. So I guess they'll just stick to what they know. And GW 1 had no raids, as far as I know. So I wouldn't get my hopes too high of seeing them in GW 2 in the future.

I can't answer the business aspect of course, but I guess they're probably better off at catering to the more casual oriented gamers and most importantly fixing the huge amount of bugs that are still hampering the gaming experience in various parts of the game.

I'm not sure if Guild Wars 1 had raids or not. Guild Wars 1 had difficult 12-man content that was raid-like certainly. Urgoz's Warren and the Deep in Factions play very much like a raid.

And while they didn't actually have the holy trinity you did need some very specific skill sets to get through those places. People would have sign up sheets for their guild, get together on weekends and run them.

What they didn't have was gear grind or lockouts, but you could get Zodiac Weapons dropped in them, and some very specific stuff from the end game chest.

In fact, all the end game content, Underworld, Fissure of Woe, Domain of Anguish, Slave's Exile probably had more in common with raids than most people think.

[Lagger]

Sales...or subs. That's a very different question. I know a lot of people who like the new WoW expansion, and a few who went back and found they couldn't play it.

It depends on a lot of things including what else becomes available on the market between then and now.

Subs. And if the speculations about that expansions are true (there's little to nothing but a guess right now), they will flock back as if the messiah himself came down on earth and told them to. Burning Legion is a direct attempt to play on the yearning for TBC gameplay, which most people regarded as the most successful phase in WoW.

[Vayne]

Subs. And if the speculations about that expansions are true (there's little to nothing but a guess right now), they will flock back as if the messiah himself came down on earth and told them to. Burning Legion is a direct attempt to play on the yearning for TBC gameplay, which most people regarded as the most successful phase in WoW.

I think you're wrong but time will tell.

Edit: Thought I'd expand on this. People move on. The new people playing WoW (because a lot of the original players have left) have less vested interest in an older game. The older crowd might come back if they're not doing other things, but many of them are also older now and I know from experience, there really is no going back.

Stuff I thought was great 20 years ago, seeing again isn't necessarily as great. We associate in our minds more than just the events of that game. For example, WoW was a first MMO for most people and you can never be the first again. Doesn't really matter how good an MMO is if people expect the same feeling as their first. Though I started playing WoW before Guild Wars, and though Guild Wars isn't a true MMO, I still think of it as my first, and therefore, I have stronger feelings for it than I do for any other game..and every game gets compared to Guild Wars in my head. This is the first game to live up to it, because the universe is the same and there's enough call back.

But the truth is, I couldn't easily go back to Guild Wars 1 today even if it came out with a great expansion. I've moved on.

[Manga4life]

The raid argument is a little silly at this point since ArenaNet basically said we won't be getting any and the argument about whether or not raiding is popular or if people like it is all within the eye of the beholder. One person will come along and say people love raiding while the other will say they know people who hate it or that they know people who *insert whatever the topic is here* while trying to support their argument, so there is no real point in it.

As I said before, I like raiding to a certain extent, but I hate how certain raids get lost by the wayside when new raids come out. Companies need to find a way to make older raids relevant, WoW's transmorg idea was good for a short time but now they have become irrelevant again. Maybe if they updated the difficulty and added some extra rewards like gold or justice points or something....

Either way, GW2 will likely never have raiding but it could use more level 80 dungeons. Doing the same dungeon in 3 different modes is not acceptable for most.

[TitanBlade]

I'm a professional writer and I've been a professional editor. Your analysis of the writing is likely that of an amateur. I'm sure I could edit the hell out of this and make it "better"...but better for whom and how.

I'm more objective of the writing, when I look at it, than anyone else, because it was my job to be objective. It's very condescending to say that if I don't agree with your opinion that I can't be objective.

The writing is the way it is because of the format. Writing to spec, within format often creates results that aren't optimal, which isn't about sub par writing at all. It's about writing to spec.

When you look at the paths and how they intertwine, which I can see, having done most of the stories, it really is quite brilliant. How characters from the different beginnings all come together, and are part of the story later on, depending on which character you choose.

Some of the passing NPC conversations are also quite good. There are some that aren't as good, but that's how writing works. You can't write hundreds of pages of dialogue for characters and have all of it amazing.

Some of it is trite, and some if it is cliche, but to some degree that's to be expected, because they're following the Guild Wars 2 brand. They'd have had a lot more freedom of the game had an older rating, and they hadn't decided that everyone was going to be a white knight kind of hero. Tha'ts a design decision not a writing decision that the writers have to live with.

But frankly, if you want to believe you know more about writing than I do, go right ahead. I still won't make you right.

You’re a professional writer and editor and you spend 15 hours a day arguing points on a GW2 forum trying to 1 up people with long and detailed posts that cover up your arrogance?

You sir, must have had a booming and successful career.

[Vayne]

You’re a professional writer and editor and you spend 15 hours a day arguing points on a GW2 forum trying to 1 up people with long and detailed posts that cover up your arrogance?

You sir, must have had a booming and successful career.

Actually I'm retired, but it's okay. You didn't know that. I had a very successful career thanks, and made a lot of money doing it. The fact that you think that everyone does everything forever is yet another sign of your youth and inexperience.

You'll understand one day, when you're older.

[Fey]

yet another sign of your youth and inexperience.

You'll understand one day, when you're older.

Being old =\= experience. Old people often can't adapt to things that change. More often than not they're also dead set on wanting to keep things the way they've been rather than fix them for the better. And even more so, the reason they're stuck in said mindsets are because of their lack of experience despite being old. SOPA and PIPA were a thing because old people don't understand technology.

Not that I'm defending TitanBlade, because that comment was uncalled for. But an argument of age yielding experience is irrelevant.

[bokiz333]

Wow you guys are just arguing random stuff now. Older <> experience by default but there is a good corellation there. You've been around 50-60 years, you've seen more things than some 18 year old kid most likely. Not true in EVERY case but as a generality its ok to say. It's like you're arguing to argue which is ok since I've been on the internet before but this thread is just silly. And not the good kind, robin brought to you by a kitten kinda silly.

[Vayne]

Being old =\= experience. Old people often can't adapt to things that change. More often than not they're also dead set on wanting to keep things the way they've been rather than fix them for the better. And even more so, the reason they're stuck in said mindsets are because of their lack of experience despite being old. SOPA and PIPA were a thing because old people don't understand technology.

Not that I'm defending TitanBlade, because that comment was uncalled for. But an argument of age yielding experience is irrelevant.

Well, I responded to him the best I could on short notice. The fact is, I rarely spend more than an hour and a half a day doing this, but because I type and think really fast, I type the first thing that comes to mind. It's not always the best thing.

But since Titan Blade's comment was completely uncalled for and unnecessary, I took the low road this time.

I agree that age <> experience but by the same token, it sure can. The more things you have exposure to, the more you eventually learn and if you've had more time to have that exposure, then you end up learning more. Those who are older and have NOT been exposed to a lot of ideas, are definitely not going to be open-minded, but I'm far more open minded than you might thing, even if I have strong opinions.

I come from a different background as you, and I have different opinions. Opinions can't be wrong. They're just different. Doesn't make me close-minded.

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Wow you guys are just arguing random stuff now. Older <> experience by default but there is a good corellation there. You've been around 50-60 years, you've seen more things than some 18 year old kid most likely. Not true in EVERY case but as a generality its ok to say. It's like you're arguing to argue which is ok since I've been on the internet before but this thread is just silly. And not the good kind, robin brought to you by a kitten kinda silly.

It doesn't take careful reading of Titan Blade's post to see he was trying to be offensive, as well as questioning my credentials. The fact is, I answered him as I did because I've worked to hard to take that kind of crap from someone who has no clue about what I do or did in real life.

It's a fight fire with fire thing, something I usually don't do, but it is 6 am.

[TitanBlade]

Well, I responded to him the best I could on short notice. The fact is, I rarely spend more than an hour and a half a day doing this, but because I type and think really fast, I type the first thing that comes to mind. It's not always the best thing.

But since Titan Blade's comment was completely uncalled for and unnecessary, I took the low road this time.

I agree that age <> experience but by the same token, it sure can. The more things you have exposure to, the more you eventually learn and if you've had more time to have that exposure, then you end up learning more. Those who are older and have NOT been exposed to a lot of ideas, are definitely not going to be open-minded, but I'm far more open minded than you might thing, even if I have strong opinions.

I come from a different background as you, and I have different opinions. Opinions can't be wrong. They're just different. Doesn't make me close-minded.

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It doesn't take careful reading of Titan Blade's post to see he was trying to be offensive, as well as questioning my credentials. The fact is, I answered him as I did because I've worked to hard to take that kind of crap from someone who has no clue about what I do or did in real life.

It's a fight fire with fire thing, something I usually don't do, but it is 6 am.

I can't comment on what you have achieved in your life. Only by how you present yourself on here in the written form.

I do not feel that may post was uncalled for.

And the fact that you have so far thrown out over the last 2 pages:

1) What a huge success story you are by throwing it in other people faces.
2) How you have exceled in the things you have done
3) The fact you stated you earned lots of cash (My Personal Favourite)
4) The fact your age supposedly make you correct and able to know more on the subject of computer games.

You have actually embarrassed yourself in my eyes buy reverting to some extremely childish statements.

"I am cash heavy, an Editor, and a successful writer,older, therefore I am better than you"