ArenaNet: Linsey Murdock unveils High End Ascended Gear (2012-11-13)

[Centaur]

As you should know by now (I have made that clear enough on several occasions), this game seriously lacks long term goals at max level. The way I see it, even GW1 had more to do (without gear progression) at max level than GW2.
And while introducing gear progression might give part of the community something to do, it also comes with several problems. I'll address those specifically for this case, with ascended gear being a 'mid-term goal' (ie. significantly harder to obtain than exotic gear):

1. There still is nothing to do at max level for those people who do not care about gear progression. I don't care about the legendaries or the dungeon gear sets, never did, never will. There's nothing left to do for me in this game... I'm bored. Adding gear progression doesn't solve that... it only makes me want to play the game even less.

2. It forces people to go gear grinding just to stay at max stats (which is something that most players want, even if you personally don't really see the need for it), regardless if they care about the content or not.

3. It's only a temporary solution for those players who want gear progression. What will they do once they have that next tier? The complaining about a lack of something to do will start all over again, and eventually ArenaNet will feel forced to introduce another tier.

4. Existing content will become less and less appealing to those with max stat gear, because it gets too easy. ArenaNet could tune content based on the max stat gear, but that would making it unneccessarily hard for those who don't want to grind for that gear. ArenaNet could leave it as it is, but then those with max stat gear will not see any challenge in it, and will most likely never do that content again (unless it hands out huge rewards). Or they could scale your armor stats down to whatever content you are playing much more rigorously than they do now, but then what's the point of getting better stats on your armor anyway?

5. Much of the new content will have a difficulty level that is based on the max stat gear. Especially if you also use mechanics like an infusion slot with additional functionality (that is not possible on exotic gear), then you will either force players who dislike gear grinding to play with sub-par armor, or exclude them from the new content.

6. It will give parties another reason (in addition to the inbalance between professions and the differences in character level) to exclude someone from their party. Oh, you don't have Ascended gear? Sorry, you're out.

7. It makes existing gear much less appealing (if not obsolete). A lot of players already spent quite a bit of gold or karma on exotic gear, even if they didn't love the skin all that much, because they expected it to be max gear. Now they're faced with a set of gear that has become almost obsolete, and they haven't been offered any kind of compensation or easy upgrade path.

8. In WvW, even a small difference in stats can mean the difference between winning or losing a fight, so every player who is serious about the game, will want to have max stat gear. So to stay competitive, you're forcing them to do whatever kind of grinding is required to obtain that gear (even if it means doing content that they have absolutely no interest in). And yes, even if at some point (as ArenaNet said) the gear will also be available in WvW, it's still a mid-term goal, meaning it will be significantly harder to obtain than exotic gear, needing significantly more money and/or grinding.

9. Still no nice skins. I agree that there should be much more variety in skins. But adding gear progression and allowing people to use transmutation stones (to transmute any of the skins that they apparently they don't like onto a new set of stats) isn't solving that either.

10. All of this goes against everything ArenaNet have set out to do in their manifesto... which was a BIG reason for many people to choose this game in the first place.

- - - Updated - - -

Actually, now that I think about it, they really don't need to raise stats...but they do need more, a lot more and different cosmetic gear of all different difficulties to reach. Right now, there's not nearly enough. With only one of each weapon and no armor to speak of higher than exotic, and with medium armor wearers mostly having to choose between having a long coat and having a long coat, it's quite frustrating. I think I'm looking forward to more armor choices, and I don't really care if they come with a stat upgrade or not.

That I agree with!

[Vayne]

You're right, Centaur, Guild Wars 1 had more to do at max level than Guild Wars 2....but Prophecies didn't. People need to remember that when you left Guild Wars, it was four games and a few years of content, not one game. When you finished Prophecies what you had was hard mode, the Underworld and Fissure of Woe. Even Sorrow's Furnace didn't exist yet. I'm not even sure hard mode was in at launch I think it was added later (if anyone can verify that I'd appreciate it).

You're not looking at more to do in 4 games, but in one game, and for certain, I believe Guild Wars 2 has more to do than Prophecies did at launch.

But it's a different time and it was much harder back then to burn through content. More people were new to the genre, and no one really knew how to do play the system. As time went on, of course, it all went faster and easier.

Prophecies lead you around by the nose a lot less than Guild Wars 2 does, so you have to figure it out. Guild Wars 2, not so much. But there's still more to do here than there was in Prophecies.

[Centaur]

Well, I've addressed that before as well. Prophecies was ArenaNet's very first game, and they made a lot of mistakes with that one. I would expect them to have learned from that.
On top of that, they have made it clear that they weren't trying to create a game that could compete with Prophecies, or even a game that could compete with WoW as it was back then when it was released... they were trying to create a game that could (at launch, not sometime in the future) compete with WoW as it is right now, expansions and all.
Given those facts, it's surprising how little thought they seem to have put into giving people long-term goals to keep playing...

[Venya]

Hi all

I'm usually just a lurker, but I want to say I 100% agree with Centaur and Jim Hunter (and some others who think the same, but I can't recall all your names atm, sorry).
For me it even feels Arenanet isn't the same company as it was 1 month ago anymore. Tbh that is the only logical reason I can think of, why they did this 180 tour.

btw Centaur, thanks for your link to the survey; I didn't saw it before.

[StacyX]

ArenaNet made a mistake, please don't try to put the blame for the backlash for that on the players.

That's your opinion and shouldn't be stated as factual. Just because you don't agree with the changes doesn't make it a mistake. There may be many people who like the changes.

We just don't know how this will effect the game, and until we do, everything else is speculation.

[Jim Hunter]

That's your opinion and shouldn't be stated as factual. Just because you don't agree with the changes doesn't make it a mistake. There may be many people who like the changes.

We just don't know how this will effect the game, and until we do, everything else is speculation.

Whether you agree with the gear grind or not it doesn't change the fact that A-Net did make a mistake.

If it's not the start of the gear grind that it appears to be then they should have made a clear statement about their intentions and taken the time to talk to the fans that were worried about it.

If it its the start if a gear grind then the mistake was making such a big deal over the last few years about how this is something they wouldn't do.

Either way they should have been better prepared for the backlash and shouldn't of let it escalate to the point it has.

[Vayne]

Whether you agree with the gear grind or not it doesn't change the fact that A-Net did make a mistake.

If it's not the start of the gear grind that it appears to be then they should have made a clear statement about their intentions and taken the time to talk to the fans that were worried about it.

If it its the start if a gear grind then the mistake was making such a big deal over the last few years about how this is something they wouldn't do.

Either way they should have been better prepared for the backlash and shouldn't of let it escalate to the point it has.

Even if Anet made a mistake, its' not cause for the way fans are reacting. Not necessarily people here, but people going to metacritic and rating Guild Wars 2 0 is just silly and uncalled for. Asking for a refund, pretty much the same.

It's one thing to express concern and it's another to try to sink a game, in an attempt to get your way, without even really knowing if things aren't going your way.

When I got angry with Rift, I did post on the forums, but I didn't go rate them down on fan sites or ask for a refund. There's a big difference between these things.

[Jim Hunter]

Even if Anet made a mistake, its' not cause for the way fans are reacting. Not necessarily people here, but people going to metacritic and rating Guild Wtars 2 0 is just silly and uncalled for. Asking for a refund, pretty much the same.

It's one thing to express concern and it's another to try to sink a game, in an attempt to get your way, without even really knowing if things aren't going your way.

When I got angry with Rift, I did post on the forums, but I didn't go rate them down on fan sites or ask for a refund. There's a big difference between these things.

It's still A-Net's fault for not being proactive. They should have nipped this in the bud instead of sitting on it for over a week and letting people get more and more upset.

When the people that were upset felt like they weren't being heard they did what they had to in order to get a response.

[Fey]

I don't particularly care. I'm only answering you out of respect. What Bokiz feels about me? Shrugs. I'm not his biggest fan either.

Is coo' man, just letting you know I wasn't being serious. Hah.

[Centaur]

That's your opinion and shouldn't be stated as factual. Just because you don't agree with the changes doesn't make it a mistake. There may be many people who like the changes.

Well, if they don't see this as a mistake, after telling people in their manifesto that they would never do something like this, then they should be prepared to accept the backlash, as many people clearly do see it as such.

Even if Anet made a mistake, its' not cause for the way fans are reacting. Not necessarily people here, but people going to metacritic and rating Guild Wars 2 0 is just silly and uncalled for. Asking for a refund, pretty much the same.

I agree about the metacritic/amazon rating thing... that's a bit childish. But the asking for refunds I can absolutely understand. A lot of people feel that they have been lied to, that the reason why they chose GW2 was just ArenaNet misleading them. False advertising, bait & switch... whatever you want to call it. Plenty of grounds to ask for a refund.
They were expecting to play this game for a long time, but now they have lost all faith in ArenaNet and have lost all interest in the game because of this. And ArenaNet did nothing to address their concerns. Again, if that's not a mistake, then ArenaNet should be prepared to accept the consequences.

Edit: even if ArenaNet do not see the change itself as a mistake, then their mistake is that they didn't foresee how many people felt passionate about this and the backlash it would have on their community. Still a mistake, though.