Issues with GW2

[Jim Hunter]

We cannot be sure how much of a grind will be involved. Has anet released how many hours you will be forced to sludge through lame, boring content in order to get it? No, they actually said that it will be available through multiple means. The problem I hear with that is "Not soon enough"

And I agree that titles should be expanded. They are lame atm to say the least. I want my title right over my head so people can see it. I would have been fine with cosmetic only upgrades, but once you have the look you want, its negligable. I could use 10 man content, but that too will close the doors on people who don't.

The difference is 10 man content wouldn't affect how other people want to play the game. Not having the highest level gear on the other hand will have people excluding players that only have exotic. Also when we get further along the hamster wheel you will have players 1 shotting mobs in lower level areas, unless they decide to start down grading gear in the lower areas as well which would defeat the purpose of the higher gear anyway.

We have already heard plenty about gear progressions affect on WvW but the biggest problem in my opinion is how it diminishes the end game content instead of giving us a reason to replay existing content.

Why should anyone want to replay sorrows embrace if there are absolutely no rewards for it. Adding a legendary skin that rarely drops from the bosses gives people a reason to play it. Or rare crafting materials. Adding a higher level of gear that they can't get from that dungeon does not.

[Alexanian]

The difference is 10 man content wouldn't affect how other people want to play the game. Not having the highest level gear on the other hand will have people excluding players that only have exotic. Also when we get further along the hamster wheel you will have players 1 shotting mobs in lower level areas, unless they decide to start down grading gear in the lower areas as well which would defeat the purpose of the higher gear anyway.

We have already heard plenty about gear progressions affect on WvW but the biggest problem in my opinion is how it diminishes the end game content instead of giving us a reason to replay existing content.

Why should anyone want to replay sorrows embrace if there are absolutely no rewards for it. Adding a legendary skin that rarely drops from the bosses gives people a reason to play it. Or rare crafting materials. Adding a higher level of gear that they can't get from that dungeon does not.

I havent seen anyone, ever ask to see what gear im wearing before getting an invite to a party for dungeons.

The problem with gear scaling in low areas is already a problem. Not related to the new gear. This does need addressing

We do not know if anet is planning on having the ascended gear be rare drops in explorable dungeon modes. (not likely, but not impossible)

[bokiz333]

Think about the logical fallacy of what you said "Who said it will be a grind, maybe it's easy to get"...if it's easy to get, why would they introduce it? THEY said it's designed as a bridge from fairly easy to get exotics to VERY hard to obtain legengary...so they will be harder to get than lexotics, in a very specific effort to give certain players something to work for in the meanwhile. If it was easy to get, then it doesn't do the job they want it to do.

That's why it doesn't make sense if they are easy to get or if this is a one time thing. At least if you're going to introduce gear/stat creep, then go all in and at least keep the Skinner box people if you're not going to keep the originally intended audience.

[Alexanian]

I didnt say easy to get, it may take time playing the game and/or gold. But whats easy for one, is hard for another.

I play 4-5 nights a week 3-4 hours and I still dont have all exotics yet. Can I say its hard to get exotics? Sure

Its all relative.

[Lagger]

That is a very circular argument though. There is no reason to keep playing WoW at end game either, you get bigger numbers and that is about it.

Let me guess, you have never been in WoW endgame, right?

[Alexanian]

Let me guess, you have never been in WoW endgame, right?

Satisfaction of destroying challenging content and gaining a visible symbal that you did it.

[Lagger]

Satisfaction of destroying challenging content and gaining a visible symbal that you did it.

How about satisfaction that you mastered a challenge that took you as a guild most of the times more than a month (if you're not in the real top elite) and the knowledge that each successive clear of that raid instance is improving your whole team's coordination, motivation, gear-power and you can even start funky stuff like speedkills and whatnot. And there's the competition and respect with/to-from other guilds.

So saying WoW endgame is about getting bigger numbers has clearly never understood what WoW endgame is about.

P.S.: When I said "took you more than a month" what I actually meant was 3-4 months and below a certain percentage even into the next content. Yes, fights can be that tricky. I've seen guilds work on one boss for over a month.

[Centaur]

I disagree that adding gear progression alone makes gw2 a generic mmo. Its use of other games ideas delivered with their own brand is something to be proud of. This has been a great gameworld to explore (far from generic). The combat system is much more alive (ie:real time) then most I have played, and I have played many. Those are a few things that make it unique, even with added gear prgression.

Full discloser-
I am neither happy, nor upset about gear progression.
The end game has left me wanting......(Maybe gear progression is the fix for me, maybe I need 10 man content?)

Many other mmo's have a great and original gameworld. In that aspect GW2 isn't so special. Yes, the combat is special, but there are already MMO's that do dynamic combat better than GW2. One of the things (apart from the lack of subscription fee) that made ArenaNet and GW2 stand out most, was the very clear and fairly revolutionary design manifesto. By adding gear progression at endgame, and endgame content that requires that new gear, they are basically declaring their own design manifesto null and void. Which brings them a huge leap closer to being a generic MMO.

And yes, I do agree with you about the endgame, but I don't think introducing gear progression is the solution... in fact, I think it only makes the problem bigger.

[Lagger]

Yeah, I'm double posting.. sue me, this is a different point I'm making.

I think it's worth exploring the question what ANet intends to fix with this. We can argue about gear tiers/grind or no grind all day long, as has been shown before, but the real issue is if any of the changes are actually addressing any of the problems people have with the game.

My opinion is still that ANet introducing tiered gear levels ain't the bad thing in itself. It's that they're doing something that only a very small portion actually asked for. My fear is that they heard "We want endgame content" and translated it in their minds as "We want WoW endgame content with gear to progress through". If the latter is truly the case, then they're truly doomed.

- - - Updated - - -

And yes, I do agree with you about the endgame, but I don't think introducing gear progression is the solution... in fact, I think it only makes the problem bigger.

This, very much.

[Alexanian]

How about satisfaction that you mastered a challenge that took you as a guild most of the times more than a month (if you're not in the real top elite) and the knowledge that each successive clear of that raid instance is improving your whole team's coordination, motivation, gear-power and you can even start funky stuff like speedkills and whatnot. And there's the competition and respect with/to-from other guilds.

So saying WoW endgame is about getting bigger numbers has clearly never understood what WoW endgame is about.

P.S.: When I said "took you more than a month" what I actually meant was 3-4 months and below a certain percentage even into the next content. Yes, fights can be that tricky. I've seen guilds work on one boss for over a month.

Yes, my feeling exactly with more words. I thought anet could give me similar satisfaction in a more casual "pickup" kinda gameplay.