I don't see what you say WoW offers as good things. The fact that GW2 mostly doesn't have them is the good thing about the game.Originally Posted by zilliman
You seem to regard grinding for virtual toys as the 'reward' for playing a game. I play games for fun.
The biggest flaw with WoW is it leads you around by the nose and gives you no freedom at all. The longer WoW has been around the cruddier it has gotten for this one flaw in their quest design. Obviously people must like this since they keep taking more and more choice away from players, I guess it is being aimed at people like you who miss it. The best part of GW2 is you have freedom to play the way you want, I would hate to see them take any part of that away.
I'm inclined to think that if you approach Guild Wars 2 as just another MMO, having played a variety of recent MMOs without having spent a lot of time playing other types of RPGs, you'll almost certainly be inequipped to enjoy what it has to offer. What it has to offer is a degree of freedom and flexibility most other MMOs don't offer. You're not locked into a single role, you're not forced down a single path, you're not limited.
If you're a warrior, for example, you can play as as a ranged character without ever engaging in melee. If you're a ranger, you can play a melee character and bring a ranged pet with you. If you're a caster, you can "sort of" tank, as in the necromancer, and you can be perfectly fine in melee as a mesmer. In fact, the most popular ele builds right now are in your face, dagger dagger builds. In most games, casters have to stay in the back and hope someone else keeps them out of trouble. That's not the case in Guild Wars 2. You can play support as almost any profession including a warrior. Flexibility and freedom.
Now, some people WANT that freedom, and some people want rigidly defined roles, and hand-holding. And you know, there's nothing wrong with that. But a game that offers rigidly defined roles and hand-holding isn't necessarily a better game. Nor is it necessarily a worse game. It's a different game.
Since Guild Wars 2 has released, some of us have put hundreds of hours into it. The world is a lot bigger than you say/think it is (I don't know why you think it's small, because it's not). It has dungeons (most of which I could care less about ) and it has vast underwater areas to explore (most of which I quite like). It has a lot of hidden minidungeons and jumping puzzles as well, but you have to be willing to look for them. It's not just a star on your map.
As an example, I did an event in the Diessa Plateau, and at the end of it, a portal opened. Nothing tells me that I had to do that event, but there it was. It took me to a minidungeon called The Flame Temple Tombs, which had puzzles to solve and creatures to kill and eventually a chest at the end with rewards. I didn't even know it was there. You can get 100% world completion without ever touching it. But it was fun as hell.
What this game has to offer is experience, and the experience is its own reward. Naturally you'll get other rewards along the way in game, but that's not the main course for many of us, if not most of us.
Horses for courses. I enjoyed WoW for 2 years, but i ain't a grinder, and that's what the game is aimed at. I loved the leveling in its vanilla years, but it was my first MMO. I hated the fact that new players got a leg up in leveling later on and could reach lvl 60 in a week of moderate play. It is all about the end game and rushing through the levels. Whats the point in these massive areas if you ain't gonna explore them.
I agree that questing in WOW has become a "follow the signs" affair. I do not enjoy it really. I'd prefer much fewer but more elaboarate quests that would make you travel more, explore more, think a bit more. But quests are just a means to an end, which is top level and raiding or PvPing.
Hybrid classes evolved into specialised classes in WoW, often becoming better than the "normal" classes. Eg a caster druid would put out more damage than a mage or warlock and a paladin healer would heal better than a priest. This came after many years of complaints or otherwise known as "customer feedback".
It seems to me that the only sacrosanct thing in WoW has been the hardness of the top level raids: regardless what other changes have been made, the final raids are always very hard.
It also seems to me that it "customer feedback", all 10 million of them, that has made WoW what it is today. It is what the players want.
A worse game and easy leveling. Ask the original vanilla players that and see what response you get. All about the end game and nothing else. It seems you did just come on here to big up WoW. Why didn't you just say so in the titleMerry Christmas by the way
Last edited by Peaveywolf; 12-24-2012 at 07:02 PM.
Actually, Vanilla was different. There were lots of reasons to run various non-end game dungeons. Especially since dungeons used to cost money via hefty repair bills and expensive consumables. You couldn't just raid and then log off.A worse game and easy leveling. Ask the original vanilla players that and see what response you get. All about the end game and nothing else. It seems you did just come on here to big up WoW. Why didn't you just say so in the title
PvP used to be super hardcore as well. At first there was zero rewards and no BG's. You did it because you loved it (which a lot of us did) and once the honor system was added in, you were competing with everyone on your faction for ranks every week so you had to keep doing it if you wanted to gain ranks.
When I stop and think about it, classic WoW had more to do than GW2. There were a crap ton of really long immersive quest chains that you made you figure out how to finish them, that had a lot of story and lore attached. This was before things like quest tracker and WoWhead were around to guide you to them. Crafting was ridiculously important and difficult to level. It took a lot of time to get anything accomplished.
In GW2 I hit lvl 80 after about 4 days. I was fully geared the same week that I hit max level. Legendaries were made within the first month. To this day, there are only a very select few players that have even entered level 60 Naxxramas at level 60 let alone completed it. (which is now removed, those players will forever be the only ones to have done it)
By comparison to Vanilla WoW, GW2 is ridiculously easy. It didn't start to streamline and become simplified until Burning Crusade released.
You make this WoW comparison after the countless threads about the positives and negatives about GW2? If you havent seen a single one, you need to SEARCH?. My god, your expecting us to repeat everything that other reviewers have done? Oh hey, Youtube usually gets you good first hits. Hmm. And for the record, WoW does not have the complexity of WvW. They loose there by far, off the top of my head.
A Real team player never gives his enemy anything but fear.
This is a very silly statement. I doubt even 1 million of the WoW players out there give any kind of feedback and I doubt more than 15% of the feedback is taken seriously in any event. Have you ever LOOKED at the feedback MMO players give to companies. The fact is, most feedback is never acted upon by any company and pretty much any company that tries to act on feedback is doomed anyway.
To say that all WoW players even like WoW is a misnomer, since I know a few who are still subscribed but are annoyed or are bored by it. Why are they subscribed? Different reasons. Their friends are there. They always go back because it's addictive. But addictive doesn't mean fun.
I have two sons who used to play WoW for years. They were hard core raiders. One of them is bored with it and says he'll never go back, but he's been saying that for years. And every time he repays for a subscription, he plays for a month and he's bored again. In fact, he's bored as soon as he's paid. I'm pretty sure he's never given feedback. The other son doesn't know what to do with himself and he keeps subscribing in the hopes that he'll somehow like it more, which he doesn't. That's 2 of your 10 million right there.
WoW isn't the way it is because of consumer feedback. In fact, getting anything the fan base can agree on in any game is nigh on impossible.
Hah, misread that. yes^
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