Any Old Skool Asheron's Call Players in Beta?

[Abused]

If there are any of you around, I'm wondering if this game meets the standard all other MMOs have failed to achieve since our game faded away.

AC on so many levels was more complex and rich than today's kiddie games to reach the broad audience. I get that it's more profitable to have a broad reach and am not complaining but I do long for a game with the skill system and open world feel of the original Asheron's Call. Everything I've read of this game leads me to believe they've made a real attempt to take the best idea from every sucessful MMO and make these idea work.

I'm hoping for some insight from an AC perspective.

Thanks!

- Supasweet (Asheron's Call)
- Abused (World of Warcraft)
- Soulicide (StarWars the Old Republic)

[Centaur]

Hi Abused, welcome to these forums. I don't think you will get a reply from anyone in closed beta, as people who are in closed beta are not even allowed to tell. Other than that, yes, I agree with you that ArenaNet are trying hard to take the best ideas used in all MMO's... and to further improve upon ideas that have potential but still weren't really 'fun' in their current implementations. But I can't offer any insights from an AC perspective, as I've never played that game myself.

[BJHawk]

I agree with you that AC was/is the best. I was still a kid when I played my dad's account 10+ years ago.

I've played a lot of games since, and none has really satisfied me in the same way. GW2 looks closer than many. The break from the holy trinity class concept is a big step in the right direction, and I hope and believe we'll see more games doing that in the future.

I never knew anyone who made it to anything like endgame in AC, but that's kind of the point. One didn't grind through tons of boring content to get to the good stuff. It was all good, and progression was good in itself. I think GW2 is trying to accomplish this very thing.

However, I don't think GW2 has anything like the beautifully complicated attribute+skill system of AC. Most modern games seem to be focused on simplifying advancement as much as possible. I enjoyed the planning and goal-setting almost as much as I enjoyed playing the game! But, I guess you have to make games somewhat dummy-proof to appeal to the masses.

[Ageofwars]

The only Mmo that i did like was Archlord .. but the game got f*cked up by new hosts =/ ..

[Abused]

I agree with you that AC was/is the best. I was still a kid when I played my dad's account 10+ years ago.

However, I don't think GW2 has anything like the beautifully complicated attribute+skill system of AC. Most modern games seem to be focused on simplifying advancement as much as possible. I enjoyed the planning and goal-setting almost as much as I enjoyed playing the game! But, I guess you have to make games somewhat dummy-proof to appeal to the masses.

The skill system is what I miss the most. You could litterally be a level 100 cook and have done nothing else

The sheer nervousness of putting points into the wrong skill or the complicated templates players came up with such as the GrampaMage who had no offensive capability until level 40 was crazy and exciting. The quests and the raids were amazing and highly repeatable AND it was NEVER about the gear. In most cases you did AC raids for resources such as Atlan tools or armor modifiers etc. Games today miss the point of repeatability and give up on players by using cheap tactics such as time sinks like farming or dailys to keep people online and ultimately lose players.

How awesome was the vassel & loyalty system? It's unbelievable that this hasn't been replicatd just for the amazing community it created...

[Abused]

Hi Abused, welcome to these forums. I don't think you will get a reply from anyone in closed beta, as people who are in closed beta are not even allowed to tell. Other than that, yes, I agree with you that ArenaNet are trying hard to take the best ideas used in all MMO's... and to further improve upon ideas that have potential but still weren't really 'fun' in their current implementations. But I can't offer any insights from an AC perspective, as I've never played that game myself.

Thanks Centaur. I've been following the development of GW2 for over a year now and really hope it succeeds to keep the hardcore base happy with means other than WoW type raiding. That gets SO boaring to me. I have or should I say had 6 level 85s and once I finally broke away, found that I played the game because there was no better option, not because I truly enjoyed it like AC.

[BJHawk]

The skill system is what I miss the most. You could litterally be a level 100 cook and have done nothing else

The sheer nervousness of putting points into the wrong skill or the complicated templates players came up with such as the GrampaMage who had no offensive capability until level 40 was crazy and exciting. The quests and the raids were amazing and highly repeatable AND it was NEVER about the gear. In most cases you did AC raids for resources such as Atlan tools or armor modifiers etc. Games today miss the point of repeatability and give up on players by using cheap tactics such as time sinks like farming or dailys to keep people online and ultimately lose players.

How awesome was the vassel & loyalty system? It's unbelievable that this hasn't been replicatd just for the amazing community it created...

Oh man, you're making me miss AC too much now! I'd half forgotten about the incredible vassal-patron allegiances. That was a truly brilliant system. Seriously, I wonder why no one else has adopted anything similar? In many ways, AC seems like the forgotten MMORPG, yet in my mind it still stands above anything I've seen since. And yes, I know something about all the various builds and strategies. But the beauty of it all was that you could do anything you wanted, but safely. You could optimize, but you couldn't really "break" a character by doing other stuff. It's the only game I've seen that was friendly to pure builds, less pure builds, hybrid builds, and even jack-of-all-trades. My dad was the developer of ACPlanner, if you ever saw/used/read about it. It was sort of an updated Splitpea after Splitpea was obsoleted by the changes to magic spell ingredients and the addition of Prismatic Tapers and new skills.

Lastly, I LOVE the randomly generated loot, which is almost entirely absent in modern games. Sure, it's easier to have boring sameness, but it was awesome to go around finding items that were actually unique. Man, now I'm going to have to open a subscription or something...

[Abused]

Oh man, you're making me miss AC too much now! I'd half forgotten about the incredible vassal-patron allegiances. That was a truly brilliant system. Seriously, I wonder why no one else has adopted anything similar? In many ways, AC seems like the forgotten MMORPG, yet in my mind it still stands above anything I've seen since. And yes, I know something about all the various builds and strategies. But the beauty of it all was that you could do anything you wanted, but safely. You could optimize, but you couldn't really "break" a character by doing other stuff. It's the only game I've seen that was friendly to pure builds, less pure builds, hybrid builds, and even jack-of-all-trades. My dad was the developer of ACPlanner, if you ever saw/used/read about it. It was sort of an updated Splitpea after Splitpea was obsoleted by the changes to magic spell ingredients and the addition of Prismatic Tapers and new skills.

Lastly, I LOVE the randomly generated loot, which is almost entirely absent in modern games. Sure, it's easier to have boring sameness, but it was awesome to go around finding items that were actually unique. Man, now I'm going to have to open a subscription or something...

I used your Dad's app all the time. Tell him thanks from Supasweet and Ubaleet - two level 100+ toons from Wintersebb!

and you're right about random loot. My friend and I still talk about Asheron's Call about once a month 10+ years later... That says something about the game. We played WoW together for 6 years and very rarely talk about it and I had 6 level 85s.

The lack of Random is what killed Everquest 2 for us and has been missing in almost every game. We both enjoyed grinding Olthoi and other MOBs just for that rare chance. Today you only grind for levels which is sad. The upside is both of our wives and kids see us more now

I MISS AC and wish only that they would update the engine to the graphics we expect today and I would resub!!!

[BJHawk]

Awesome, man! I emailed him; I'm sure he'll appreciate the thanks. He loved AC, and tried to maintain ACPlanner for quite a while after he quit playing. Eventually though, he had to admit he just didn't have time. I understand some things have changed a lot, so I don't even know how relevant ACPlanner still is.

I've yet to see any game that has copied even half of the awesome things about AC. Even AC2 was a totally different game, and failed to capture what made AC good. I keep expecting some of the good things from AC to spill over into other games eventually, but for some reason they haven't. AC is complicated I guess, which goes against the "reach a broader audience" philosophy of most designers these days.

Still, AC was casual-friendly, because you could play AC however you wanted to play it. There was no pressure to play hardcore, or to reach endgame where "real" fun begins. I knew people (like the 14yo me) who enjoyed powerleveling through dungeons, and I also knew people (like my dad) who ran around exploring each nook and cranny. Seriously though, running around was fun, even if you weren't actually doing anything. Which other game has that? Now, if there isn't an NPC with a yellow '!' above his head telling you to kill 10 wild boars, people are lost and clueless. That's how sadly restrictive MMORPGs have become. I'm hopeful that GW2 will break free of this mental bondage, and give us the real fun of an open world again.

[Abused]

You know the thing about AC was that is WASN'T linear! Microsoft saw what AC was and partnered with Turbine to take market share from Everquest by designing AC2 for a broader audiance. They failed simply by doing that and the partnership failed. The problem was it's linear nature, the same linear nature of ALL current MMOs especially SWTOR have. It's very easy to make a linear game but VERY difficult to please everyone when the path from 1 to X is defined and rigid. Most hardcore start griping right away and the community suffers. AC dropped you into an open world with a rich story intro. People everywhere in your starter town would compete for your patronage and support you to figure out the game because it was to their advantage (through experience point sharing) to build the community under them. Like you said, it just amazes me that this alliance format isn't used in every single game. I would prefer a horrid experience/level curve to end-game and a vassel-patron format to overcome it than any of the current game designs. SWTOR released on Dec 20th and I was level 50 in 12 days.

I'm 41 now and hope an AC type game comes out before my gaming days are over. My son's 10 now and he plays games with me but never got to enjoy AC. I would to share a truly great game with him.

Here's hoping GW2 hears our pleas!